okay
iideas
welcome to Sputnik orbiting the world
with me George Galloway and me gri
events are moving in the USA as
elsewhere at a frantic Pace Obama
increasingly taking on the appearance of
a lame duck looking as redundant to
events as a Stonehenge pillar a memory
of what once was or rather could have
been the go-to person in America is now
Hillary rodam Clinton shaping up for a
dynastic rematch with Jeb Bush brother
of the genius George W son of the
Sinister George HW our good friend Stacy
Harbert has been dodging the bullets
fired by the increasingly militarized
police over there and I'm glad to say
she's back in one piece over here to
tour the North American Horizon with us
on the Sputnik Stacy welcome back from
your quite long American sojourn you
must have absorbed the news agenda
over there tell us what struck you most
about that news agenda well the biggest
story while we were there was the
Ferguson Missouri story where a white
police officer shot dead a teenager for
jaywalking which many Europeans might
not know what jaywalking is it's
consider if you walk across the street
from one sidewalk to the other okay and
he was stopped and apparently gave some
lip back to the police officer and he
shot him dead
but the thing that was remarkable about
it is yes there is a race issue across
the United States always but this
unified people in terms of the shock at
the military looking response yeah they
were done up like uh Special Forces yeah
well exactly and they had military
vehicles they had snipers as if for a
war yeah yes and that was brought up by
many people many reporters many uh
reporters that had been in war zones
over in Iraq in Afghanistan were shocked
to see this now many Americans were not
aware since 2005 the Department of
Homeland Security has given 4.5 billion
in Grants for local governments state
governments City governments across the
United States to purchase former
military equipment from the Pentagon um
it's a program called 1033 they've
bought 12,000
bayonets bayonets policeman with
bayonets wait I thought that was the the
last time I ever heard of that was like
the US Civil War but they also bought M
wraps uh which are these uh mil um mine
resistant ambush protected Vehicles IE
to protect from
IEDs uh brever County in Florida which
is home only to 500,000 people they've
bought eight Apache helicopters the
Boeing ad uh 64 DS so those are Attack
Helicopters eight so so Boris Johnson's
water look like a Min compared that well
exactly but it's an issue people it was
shocking to see and people across the
political Spectrum were shocked to see
this so it wasn't just a question in
Missouri then I had put it down to
overzealous police Chiefs in in in
Missouri but it seems like it's a
national issue in the specific location
of Ferguson Missouri there was the race
issue but it for for it's a black Place
yeah Ferguson yeah 67% of the population
is African-American the police force
there is entirely white so you can't
deny that that was an issue there
however it you know you were talking
about the political race for president
in 2016 I think you're going to see more
of a this civil liberties is going to be
on the table in that election and you
saw the Two Front Runners I know you
said bush in there but I think that's
not going to happen uh Jeb Bush has
formed a private Equity Firm investing
in oil and natural gas as many seem to
be doing these days but on the national
stage I think the two main contenders
are going to be Hillary Clinton and Rand
Paul those are the two that also issued
uh you know powerful statements about
Ferguson Missouri actually and they both
mentioned race uh Rand Paul said that
anybody who denies that this is a race
issue uh is you know deluding themselves
yeah and he said but the more important
issue for everybody across America is
the civil liberties here we are
militarily occupied it looks like a
military occupation and you know police
forces are supposed to protect the
population from criminals not uh occupy
them no this dominated the news I'm
thinking therefore that Britain didn't
uh occupy much news in the United States
you were making the point that in
America you could forget the rest of the
world exists you really can I mean the
outside world does not exist other than
then some they they do focus on
terrorist stories but you know you don't
even know they don't even really focus
on where it is in the world it's the
Middle East whether it's Libya Syria
Iraq they can't they just say the Middle
East over there but they never talk
about Europe Europe does not Factor
especially the UK does not factor in
nobody you never I forgot you existed
here but despite despite the special
relation yeah well it's a special
relationship which is one way uh it's
the kind of special relationship Miss
Linsky had with uh President Clinton
which brings me yes to uh I take your
point about Jeb Bush not so sure that
Jeb will not run and if he runs I'm sure
that he'll win uh the nomination I mean
not necessarily the presidency but let's
focus on Hillary for a minute uh Bill
Clinton back in the White House all be
at this time unlicensed to play with the
interns Hillary very much wearing the
trousers uh
she must be a strong front
runner yes even on Fox News they're
saying Hillary is going to be next
president um she's in Iowa this coming
week and of course that's where she
famously lost to Barack Obama in the
primaries uh nobody had heard of him
before then she's there this week at the
harken steak fry which is the event for
how you do for the Democrat she's with
President Clinton uh he is his favorite
ability ratings are very good so people
love him in America and they remember
that was the last good times we had in
America when the economy was still
strong before the housing bubble collaps
before the stock market bubbles the
NASDAQ and the and the Dow Jones
collapse so I think uh he's more of a
positive this time and he learned from
the mistakes he made during the last uh
season on the you know on the stump for
Bill's not a problem yeah uh and uh if
uh being a woman there for would seem to
be her last hurdle if you like is
America having had now a black president
ready for a woman president yeah I mean
2008 remember the big issue for the
Republican party at that time was uh the
issue of gay marriage and things like
that that doesn't that's over it's been
decided the Republican political
apparatus doesn't even want to talk
about it anymore they know it's a vote
Loser on the national stage it might in
local areas but it's the Supreme Court
Court he said you know that you can't do
this uh you also have the legalization
of marijuana going on all across the us
so that that's huge shock to me amazing
so this so gunning down black people in
Missouri but at the same time legalizing
marijuana across the states yeah exactly
but you know I think that's Rand Paul
this is why I think he could actually be
a a a contender against Hillary Clinton
well let's talk about him he's the son
of no Senator the son of uh um his
father who also ran for president last
time Ron Paul Ron Paul was running as a
Libertarian right-wing but with some
leftwing positions Visa the war and so
on how different are Ron Paul and Ron
Paul well remember Ron Paul won a lot of
the primary votes B based on the
millennial young people voting um this I
I think the import important thing at
this juncture remember just this week as
we begin the new school year in America
less than 50% of the students are white
so we're becoming a a different nation
that old Republican white
Evangelical that that's a losing bet for
the future Rand Paul comes from Kentucky
he's a senator for Kentucky it's you
know part of the South and part of the
deep south of you know racism he spoke
out very well in Time Magazine he wrote
a about that not only do we need to stop
this militarization and Foreign Wars but
we have a problem with racism just like
Nixon took us you know open the
relationship with China I think it's
going to need somebody like a Rand Paul
a southerner a republican an Evangelical
sort that's going to come out and say
like this we need to move on Beyond this
this is a post-racial sort of society
for real big money would be behind Bush
against him because the military
industrial complex
can't like ran Paul because he doesn't
want to fight Wars around the world uh
Jeb Bush has the magic name what makes
you so sure that he's not going to throw
his hat in the ring I think Bush he's
just set up a private Equity Firm he's
he's he's told everybody that he's not
running in when you're in the United
States nobody the Fox News none of the
news channels were covering Bush he's
not he's not even considered at this
point it was all about Rand Paul that's
the that's the name you have you know
some of the other people like Paul Ryan
he might he was remember of Vice
presidental candidate last time but uh
again he's he's more on that uh you know
religious issues guy Paul Ryan and I
don't think I think people I think it's
beyond that now yeah so the culture wars
are over in that sense well the culture
wars will never be over there's always
those issues but I I think the culture
wars that the Republicans were fighting
in a a different Millennials are
different the the Browning of the
population is no longer controlled by
the white people as much so I think the
different issues they're more people are
more liberal Progressive so Stacy I saw
the the butler recently which together
with 12 Years a Slave the topic of which
seems to reflect what you're saying is
happening in the US the whole Revival of
the the the dark past of the US yeah P
it's relation P of the black black
Americans an outbreak of guilt about the
past uh I think it has to come to terms
with it and
then we're at that point in Ferguson
Missouri kind of showed it that you you
there are scars that you have to admit
to and and move past it but again I
think it's this Rand Paul is the
obviously the Deep South is part of
where that resentment has come from
because of the whole unresolved issues
from the Civil War speaking of the
bayonets you know that if he could I
think he could actually bring some black
vote into because there were a lot of
black voters for Ron Paul as well there
were Stacy we've toured The Horizon we
could go on doing so but unfortunately
we're out of time welcome back and
thanks very much I think it's Hillary
Clinton and Rand Paul that's my get bet
yeah well uh if that's your bet it's
also mine coming up after the break a
Daily Telegraph Grande former Moscow
based journalist Liam hallagan now on
the home beat on The Sensational
defection of a leading Tor MP to the UK
independence party don't go
away welcome back to Sputnik although
something of a figure around Parliament
Douglas Carswell was not a household
name in many houses other than his own
he is now by the simple and honorable
step of crossing the floor and resigning
from Parliament all in the one maneuver
Douglas Coswell is now poised to win the
most Sensational byelection victory
since well my husband in Bradford West
nobody summed up the Torpedoes heading
towards the government's Hull like the
telegraph star columnist Liam hallagan
and he did so in the tor's own house
journal the Sunday Telegraph which is
why we're glad he's on board the Sputnik
today Liam nice to see you tell us uh
first what kind of man is Carswell well
you know I'm not a ukip supporter um uh
I want us to have a very thorough
negotiation uh with Brussels and then
I'll decide on the basis of that
negotiation if I want us to stay in or
leave the EU ukip of course want to
leave the EU regardless having said that
I applaud Douglas Carswell and as I said
in the Sunday Telegraph I hope he wins
in clacton Douglas isn't a personal
friend of mine I've met him on several
occasions I've read a lot of his
prodigious written output and then you
you know throughout those meetings and
uh in his uh writings uh he struck me as
an honorable extremely thoughtful uh man
he doesn't only do his own research and
come to his own conclusions even more
importantly he's prepared to articulate
those conclusions in public regardless
of who is offended uh he could easily be
uh a minister now he could easily be
heading for the cabinet he's in his
early 40s he's a very good media
performer and he's extremely intelligent
and he's one of the few Tory uh types uh
if you will who has a common touch uh
with his uh
constituents I think he will win uh in
in CLA and I think that's pretty clear
well let's come to that because on the
face of it it's a rock solid uh Tor seat
the the Tor MP has in churchillian terms
ratted uh and crossed the floor um
you would think that the tourist could
hold that seat but the polls show a
record
44% absolutely uh it is of course on
paper at the moment a rock solid Tory
seat but that's because um Douglas
Carswell has nursed it um Clon of course
uh albeit uh pre uh favorable to the
Tories boundary change was a labor seat
you have uh a lot of uh people in
clacton still who are dependent on
benefits and would be seen as natural
labor OTS what's interesting though is
that many of those are on board with
Carswell now he's moved to ukip so the
question is if he can hold a lot of his
Tory natural Tory vote and attract some
of the labor vote that previously would
have voted against him uh by default
because he was uh and is uh uh
psychologically if you like a Tory but
when David Cameron responds to Douglas
carswell's move by saying this is very
bizarre very odd very strange he looks
completely out of touch not not
necessarily because Carswell has joined
ukip but beyond that in many ways
Carswell isn't a ukip man uh he's
extremely liberal in Tory terms on
immigration he's far more sophisticated
than he's not a red in tooth and Claw
Tory he's a glad stonan liberal as he
often says himself uh he's for many
years uh since he's been in Parliament
been making over churs towards um
improvements uh in our public life
compared to when he was a Youngster the
our attitude towards uh people with
disabilities to women's issues and so on
he's really you know right on and I know
he's got a lot of friends uh in
Parliament on the labor side who admire
him admire so so he isn't a kneejerk
tooran he is his own man and so he he
represents him many ways this kind of
anti-politician
politician uh but not a kind of rock
hurling anti-politician politician
somebody who who uses the uses
parliament in an extremely sophisticated
way and then again also you got to look
at the uh whether or not his defection
will lead to others I mean there are
names that you and I could mention it
would be unfair to do so a lot of people
are on maneuvers um it will be very very
interesting to see I was just going to
ask you that what does it all mean uh
does it mean the Tor party is beginning
a kind of historic cleavage uh an
organic division uh between the pro and
anti- European forces well if they
formally split in my view that will and
that will um condemn the Tories to
opposition for um you know at least two
or three Electoral Cycles uh I think
what it means and you can see it already
from uh uh what number 10 is briefing is
that um David Cameron will be pushed
more and more towards what Douglas
Carell's previous um uh colleagues uh uh
on the on the Tory benches one of course
um you know the likes have burn there's
a limit to what how far they can go sure
and it's a very very subtle game isn't
it uh there there are many Tory back
benches of course who are um Euros
Skeptics um and of course they've had to
um be seen on the airwaves in recent
days condemning Carswell and it was an
error and he's misguided I won't call
him a traitor we've known each other a
long time but I think he'll regret his
decision of course I have to say that in
public but they know that what he's done
has catalized number 10 and now you have
Cameron's minions briefing that oh uh he
may actually uh the position was uh he
will negotiate and then campaign to stay
in but now he's saying he'll negotiate
and if he doesn't like the outcome of
the negotiation he may even campaign to
take us out but of course he had it's
crazy he's had to be forced to this
position anyone who's done anything
outside of politics in their life any
kind of business who's lived in the real
world felt any kind of financial
insecurity which of course he hasn't
knows that you have to go into a
negotiation prepared to walk away yeah
yeah and he's finally got to a position
where it looks as if now almost whether
or not he say on the record he might
save it up for Tory conference or for or
for later it looks as though he is now
prepared to at least say he might walk
away um why didn't he say that earlier
and it would look so much more
convincing if he hadn't been had to have
been dragged to this position Kicking
and Screaming by fear frankly because of
what Doug Douglas Carwell has done and
what others may do uh uh in in in in the
light of his almost certain electoral
success in you know this even if you w't
openly ConEd it the the history uh all
hither to uh is the history of class
struggle now the British ruling class oh
we can talk about class if you want the
the capitalist class does not want to
leave the European Union it knows that
it would be if not beggared then Gravely
harmed by leaving the European Union so
a Tor part party cannot actually
withdraw from the European Union you you
know I I'm not sure that's true that
with all respect to you um uh and I know
you also say say what you you believe uh
uh based on on your research and so on I
think back in the early ' 70s in the
runup to the the previous referendum we
had you I was I was I was a no voter
then I I I was a peashooter then four or
five four or five years old I do
remember uh and obviously subsequently
studied that you big parts of the labor
party were no there was that kind of
Trade union no uh the benites uh and
quite you know also yeah right the way
across the party to the sort of you know
to the soft Center and even to some part
the part of the soft right who wanted to
be outside the European and there was
this sense that it was a rich man's club
and so on I would say now that yes you
have the sort of accountants and the
lawyers
uh uh and so on uh and the sort of
business implementers who want us to be
in the EU because they benefit hugely
from the of legal morass and the
accounting morass that it generates but
you know the big wielders of capital
they won't say it openly uh because they
don't want to be seen to rock the boat
they leave that to um you people like
you and me prepar to put their head over
the parit but I think increasingly the
big wielders of capital are extremely
concerned about creeping regulation uh
endless bureaucracy and also about the
the the the anachronistic side of of of
what the EU represents you know when my
kids hit the job market my oldest
daughter's 14 uh Britain should be doing
far more trade with the world outside of
the EU than within the EU we're so
focused on the EU and what we should be
doing and I think this is a a correct
part of the the ukip message though a
lot of Tories say it as well and even
the prime ministers give service to it
we should be training much much more
with the Emerging Markets the markets uh
that are growing where people are
getting wealthier the markets we
desperately need to trade with to secure
the prosperity of our children and our
uh grandchildren you know this country
does uh if you add up all the trade we
do with the big four Emerging Markets
Brazil Russia and India and China is
less than the trade we do with Belgium
which for a trading Nation with the
English language and all the historic
ties we have it is is ridiculous does it
does that reflect in the economy I I
think it does I don't think we you know
we've had we have an enormous balance of
payments uh deficit which is which is
ridiculous given you know our our our
place in the world culturally and
economically uh whereas the Germans are
completely outclassing us on this front
the German economy for all the
difficulties it has is far more future
approved in terms of the markets it's
one in the fast growing countries uh
emerging Giants of the make better
things than us they do make better
things they do they do make they do make
better things than us maybe that's part
of the problem we've talked about what
all this means for David Cameron what
does it mean for Nigel farage will he be
overshadowed slightly by a Carswell
victory in whenever this byelection is
that's a real politician's question
that's four or five uh moves ahead in on
on on the chess board I'm always
thinking well I think I think I think
Nigel farage um um to take a lot of
credit for what's happened uh you know
the political earthquake that is ukip
the the the incredible success in in the
local elections and as I say I'm not a
ukip supporter but the fact that he's
got people of the caliber and
credibility of Douglas Carswell joining
the party available to be in whatever
kind of you know shadow shadow cabinet
they they they put together Douglas will
surely attract others both from within
and outside Parliament to join you K
well uh uh just remember you heard it
here first the deadly upas tree is
deadly because nothing can grow in its
shade and njel farage is a deadly upas
tree so we'll see how he gets on with
these uh new stars coming onto the chess
Port Liam helan the telegraph lucky to
have you thank you very much thank
you and now it's your turn to tell us
what you think through the portals of
social media what's rattling gatri well
on the prospect of Hillary becoming the
next American president the people
responded quite horrified Liberty says I
hope not but it'll be business as usual
whom ever gets in in regards to the Tory
Defector Charles McGrath says a storm in
a teacup or a sign of change some
backbend stories may follow and give
ukip foot hold before 2015 and I can't
help but mention our beloved William he
again who answers that peasant thought
he start a Revolt yet backbenches merely
saw his deflection as revolting and
that's it for this week which sadly
means that's the end of the show do
please keep in touch with us on Twitter
at _ Sputnik and on Facebook you can
like us on Sputnik on Russia today it's
goodbye from me gri and from me George
Galloway it's been
marvelous
oh